H&S has no true variety pack?

[WRBarker]

So, I currently have a recurring subcription of H&S variety packs (every single one you offer in fact) but I noticed there is a glaring issue.

I like variety, in the true sense where things are just generally different on a recurring basis as it keeps life from becoming stale. Which is a real concern for people on ultra-controlled diets like Huel, Soylent, manual mixing of protein powders and macro/micro nutrient supplements, et cetera.

I have realized that my ordering and subscriptions would more closely align with what I want out a a variety pack if Huel actually offered a true variety pack and not the just the currently “themed” packs it offers.

(Although Huel does also currently have a glaring hole in the variety packs it offers in the form of one that contains everything “not spicy”, I wouldn’t be interested, but I know many people who simply can’t tolerate hot. It’s quite common in fact for people to be sensitive to especially in the older crowd. I have failed at being able to get many 65+ people onto Huel diets simply because of the fact that you can’t easily order a variety of products without a good portion of them being spicy without ordering exact quantities of specific H&S flavors.)

Huel currently has 13 flavors in the H&S line, a variety pack contains 12, weirdly it doesn’t even contain equal amounts, often being an entire random (to the consumer, I am quite certain it has something to do with your production run volume of x vs y making certain ones “cheaper” per unit for Huel corporate, combined with the act of “combining” dissimilar flavors from different runs also costing a tiny bit more), it’s 3/3/2/2/2 or 1/2/2/1/2/2/1/1.

I really don’t know who’s in your marketing department, but the lack of an “every flavor” variety pack, when variety packs are 12 and your total products produced is 13, seems like a situation of “cant see the forest for the trees” (overlooking something so obvious that no one even thinks about it).

If you offer a 13 of 13 variety pack (1/1/1/1/1/1/1/1/1/1/1/1/1) I could simple switch my recurring sub to 3x that and be done with it, also, it seems like it would be wildly better at onboarding new customers who don’t yet know what they want or like that Huel produces.

Thanks for your time, I generally expect these messages to be responded to by some PR person and then ignored in reality, but I had to at least try.

Logically I feel like there should only be 3 variety packs, because Huels texture and flavor profiles are not different enough (they are all various forms of thick-to-watery-soup depending on how much water you use) to justify theming over practical concerns.

1. Huel All Flavors Pack (13 packs, 1/…/1)
2. Huel No Spice Pack (10 packs, 2/2/2/2/2)
3. Huel Gluten Free Pack (12 packs, 3/3/3/3)

[Hope_Huel]

Hey there!

Welcome to the Huel forum!

I reached out to the Product Manager for Hot & Savory to get you some answers. Firstly, he loves the idea of a selection box that contains non-spicy options, and it’s something he’s considering.

We select what goes into the selection box based on repeat rates and new customer popularity, not by cost per unit. There isn’t a huge amount of margin variation between individual flavors–definitely not enough to change what goes in the variety box.

We don’t offer all of the flavors in one box (pasta, grains, and noodles) because shifting the noodles from Cups to Meal Packs was a recent change. The Meal Pack Pasta/Grain Variety Box came first. To add the noodles would make it a different product, such that it would be pretty disruptive to people’s existing subscriptions. The noodle customer is a bit different than the pasta customer, so we’re not sure they’d want to receive both varieties. Launching a new product using the 12-meal cartons that we already have on hand was a better option.

Our product manager’s end goal is to create a mix-and-match selection box where a customer can build their own selection box, which would probably render variety box variations like All Flavors, No Spice, or Gluten Free unnecessary. But it’s a process–this is currently something we’re testing out with the Ready-to-Drink to see if it yields a good outcome.

Hope this is helpful!

[WRBarker]

Thank you for the response, and the reasoning behind why certain things are included in what-goes-where.

Sounds like a lot of legacy carryover from previous changes.

Not sure I agree with part of the logic, as I have eaten several noodle vs. pasta flavors back to back and while the texture is slightly different, not enough so to really be relevant. More just a change for changes sake, which from a variety standing is fine. Reading the forum generally for every change of base pasta you make though, it seems like equal amounts of people are happy/angry about it.

(I.E. I read about the change from larger to smaller pasta (Huels reasoning: Less pockets of powder), and before the change I would probably have said there was more of a reasonable difference between products as the larger pasta vs the smaller noodles would have probably had a relatively large change in textures)

In the end the small pasta vs. noodles are “not different enough”, one just has a different shape.

I could maybe see the point with the rice based dishes, as they do have more of a pronounced difference vs. noodles/pasta.

Just moving to a straight mix-and-match would be great for existing customers who already know exactly what they want, but would provide no inherent value to onboarding, and I suspect Huels customer turnover rate is quite high so onboarding is probably pretty important.

I’m glad your at least considering a non-spicy pack, which would help those with IBS, diverticulitis/osis, et cetera, spice sensitivity becomes increasingly common with age.

This does bring up something else I noticed, since we are on the subject of rice/noodle/pasta.

The website is quite lacking in very basic media for individual flavors so someone can get a visual of the general presentation of each dish, each product page is identical outside of a change in description, but the description itself can be incomplete. There are zero pieces of unique media on each specific flavors page, which seems lazy? Adding unique pictures for each dish is something that should take a professional webdesigner and photographer nearly no time at all.

Example:
The noodles variety box icon implies 8 flavors through it’s icon having 8 distinct cross sections displayed, only contains five flavors, description includes explicitely which flavors are in the box.
Meanwhile, the pasta and grain variet box implies 5 flavors (the number in the other box) but it’s page description doesn’t even bother to list what the flavors that come with it, the only way you can even tell on the page how many flavors there are is with the small “from 7 meals” box (which aligns with neither icon).

Being a previous business owner (multiple times over) as well as doing my own marketing and web design I can tell you that things like this get noticed, and while some of it is nitpicky, the lack of photos of how each dish looks (even airbrushed and prepared ideally/unrealistically which is the industry standard) would motivate more customers to click through to purchase based on “that looks good”.

What’s even worse is that the image carousel on the page (all pages for all flavors) only shows “Mexican Chili” information and generic non-related basic marketing images.

[Hope_Huel]

@WRBarker

Just moving to a straight mix-and-match would be great for existing customers who already know exactly what they want, but would provide no inherent value to onboarding,

On the contrary, I think it would help a lot with onboarding. One of the most common comments we see across Hot & Savory ads is demand for a mix-and-match box from people who haven’t tried the range yet. Typically, there are flavors in the variety box they know they won’t like (if you know you don’t like coconut, for example, 2 packs of Yellow Coconut Curry feels like a waste) and they don’t want to splurge on 7-meal boxes of the flavors they are interested in, in case they don’t like it. A mix-and-match box with 1-2 packs of the 4 flavors they’re interested in feels more cost-effective, to them, than 4 x 7-meal boxes.

@WRBarker

read about the change from larger to smaller pasta

This wasn’t about size but more about shape: we went from penne pasta, which allows powder to get in the center, to fusilli pasta, which doesn’t. This change was for our legacy Pasta dishes which launched around 2020-2021 (Pasta Bolognese, Chick’n & Mushroom, Cajun Pasta, etc.) The Noodle pots were introduced in 2023 as a wholly new product, more like ramen or pot noodles that you see in the UK. These are largely inspired by Asian dishes (Thai noodles, Japanese Curry, Korean BBQ, etc), which not everyone is a fan of. We transitioned the noodle flavors to meal packs and vice versa based on demand. Appreciate that you don’t find them too different from the pasta/grains, but I’m not sure this is a universal sentiment.

@WRBarker

Adding unique pictures for each dish is something that should take a professional webdesigner and photographer nearly no time at all.

I’m not totally sure what you mean, as clicking on “Learn More” gives you a picture of each individual dish, as well as the flavors in each variety box. Included some examples below.

@WRBarker

The noodles variety box icon implies 8 flavors through it’s icon having 8 distinct cross sections displayed, only contains five flavors,

I think you’re right about this: the Noodle and Pasta/Grain boxes seem to be swapped in this regard. I’ll pass that along.

[WRBarker]

@Hope_Huel

On the contrary, I think it would help a lot with onboarding. One of the most common comments we see across Hot & Savory ads is demand for a mix-and-match box from people who haven’t tried the range yet. Typically, there are flavors in the variety box they know they won’t like (if you know you don’t like coconut, for example, 2 packs of Yellow Coconut Curry feels like a waste) and they don’t want to splurge on 7-meal boxes of the flavors they are interested in, in case they don’t like it. A mix-and-match box with 1-2 packs of the 4 flavors they’re interested in feels more cost-effective, to them, than 4 x 7-meal boxes.

This was a misunderstanding on my part, I was not aware there was functionally no way to order a specific number of individual portions of your product. Which brings up a whole nother question of… why?… I can’t think of a single industry where getting one unit (or any number of units not a multiple of 7) is impossible.

In what I would consider a “normal” product based business I should be able to order 1 or 1,128 packets of, say, mac n’ cheese, at a whim.

If shipping single units is cost prohibitive, why not use industry standars like putting a minimum order amount (which is where combo boxes come into play, normally), or a sliding bulk discount so that a single unit is expensive on it’s own, and cheap in bulk.

Was this done in order to drive packaging & labor costs as low as possible by nearly eliminating variability in size / weight (of packaging) and time on task (labor), et cetera?

@Hope_Huel

This wasn’t about size but more about shape: we went from penne pasta, which allows powder to get in the center, to fusilli pasta, which doesn’t. This change was for our legacy Pasta dishes which launched around 2020-2021 (Pasta Bolognese, Chick’n & Mushroom, Cajun Pasta, etc.) The Noodle pots were introduced in 2023 as a wholly new product, more like ramen or pot noodles that you see in the UK. These are largely inspired by Asian dishes (Thai noodles, Japanese Curry, Korean BBQ, etc), which not everyone is a fan of. We transitioned the noodle flavors to meal packs and vice versa based on demand. Appreciate that you don’t find them too different from the pasta/grains, but I’m not sure this is a universal sentiment.

I was not a customer for the change in type of pasta, I only read about the perception of the change was that the volume of the pasta as a whole shrunk considerably, which was the main complaint as I interpreted it.

In short, the fusilli (corkscrew) pasta was physically smaller by volume than the penne (cylinder) pasta, which makes total sense if you consider the geometry involved.

But that was just an example and not really the meat of my point anyway.

It’s not that I don’t find them different from Pasta/grains, it’s that it makes little sense from a texture standpoint that noodles and pasta are different vs. pasta/noodles to rice.

You currently pair rice dishes in a pack with pasta, which are quite different, but separate out noodle dishes which are just a different form of pasta with an only slightly different mouth feel.

So pasta/noodles (as a combo) would make far more sense than pasta/rice (which share no commonality in texture). Ideally, if you were bundling, there would be no crossover and each would be it’s own thing… but I am still trying to wrap my head around the very odd way ordering is done.

What was the logic to the 7-unit standard box minimum?

The only thing I can think of is that it’s one weeks worth of 1/5th DV, but that’s pretty arbitrarily specific.

@Hope_Huel

I’m not totally sure what you mean, as clicking on “Learn More” gives you a picture of each individual dish, as well as the flavors in each variety box. Included some examples below.

I see this, the question is… why? That information should just be on the page specific to that product. The “learn more” button is not intuitive and honestly makes the situation even worse, as because the media already exists it would be beyond trivial to just put it on the actual page for the specific product, and not in it’s own page from a random link that looks like it would take you to a marketing page about the “how” you make your product and not the actual specifics for the product itself.

You’ve got a totally superfluous website function. Clicking “Learn more” just brings up a second, separate description of the product, and a product picture, but you can go to the product page and… also get a description of the product… but it’s not the same, and it’s missing a picture.

The “Learn more” button has no reason for existing when everything it does is already done on the product page (minus the actually representative picture).

Can you name another business that when you click on an item in the web store, it doesn’t actually go anywhere, and only changes some flavor text on the upper-right portion of the page? …and that you’ve got to click a different portion of the page to get the same information worded differently, potentially more accurately, with a picture.

Why are there two different buttons you can use to go to two different places in order to get two different descriptions of the same thing on the same page?

Thanks for remaining engaged BTW. If I didn’t like the concept of your product I wouldn’t be nearly as… opinionated…

[Hope_Huel]

@WRBarker

shipping single units is cost prohibitive, why not use industry standars like putting a minimum order amount (which is where combo boxes come into play, normally), or a sliding bulk discount so that a single unit is expensive on it’s own, and cheap in bulk.

Shipping single units is both cost-prohibitive and unaligned with our sustainability goals. Bulk products are generally more efficient. We used to have an order minimum, but it was not popular.

@WRBarker

It’s not that I don’t find them different from Pasta/grains, it’s that it makes little sense from a texture standpoint that noodles and pasta are different vs. pasta/noodles to rice.

Appreciate that you don’t find them different, but for most, the noodles are a different flavour profile than the pasta/grains: both spicier and more East & Southeast Asian-inspired.

@WRBarker

What was the logic to the 7-unit standard box minimum?

I believe the logic is that this is a week’s worth of meals (lunch/dinner).

@WRBarker

The “Learn more” button has no reason for existing when everything it does is already done on the product page (minus the actually representative picture).

I disagree. In addition to the representative picture, there’s a description of the flavour profile and allergens that is not on the Hot & Savory page itself. For the Mac & Cheeze, this is: “an indulgent, creamy pasta with a subtle smoky cheese flavor and a hint of garlic. Not: contains wheat.”

@WRBarker

Can you name another business that when you click on an item in the web store, it doesn’t actually go anywhere, and only changes some flavor text on the upper-right portion of the page?

Yes, clicking on an item and getting more details, rather than going to another page, is quite common practice. Overnight Oats, for one. This is the sort of thing we’d like to set up eventually, where a person can build their own custom box.

Appreciate the feedback. I’ve passed it to the H&S Product Manager and Ecommerce manager, respectively. Let us know if we can help with anything else!

[WRBarker]

@Hope_Huel

@WRBarker

shipping single units is cost prohibitive, why not use industry standars like putting a minimum order amount (which is where combo boxes come into play, normally), or a sliding bulk discount so that a single unit is expensive on it’s own, and cheap in bulk.

Shipping single units is both cost-prohibitive and unaligned with our sustainability goals. Bulk products are generally more efficient. We used to have an order minimum, but it was not popular.

Thanks for the context.

@Hope_Huel

@WRBarker

It’s not that I don’t find them different from Pasta/grains, it’s that it makes little sense from a texture standpoint that noodles and pasta are different vs. pasta/noodles to rice.

Appreciate that you don’t find them different, but for most, the noodles are a different flavour profile than the pasta/grains: both spicier and more East & Southeast Asian-inspired.

Ahh, I see we have a fundamental misunderstanding here. Your noodle dishes are only different because you flavor them differently. I am arguing from a texture standpoint. In that you could theoretically change any of your pasta flavors to use equal-volume noodles as your noodle dishes and they wouldn’t fundamentally change. As evidenced by you’ve already done the switch once.*
*
That still doesn’t explain why you combine rice w/ pasta, as they don’t share themes either, on top of not sharing texture as rice is fundamentally different from pasta (of which noodles are a sub-type of pasta).

@Hope_Huel

@WRBarker

What was the logic to the 7-unit standard box minimum?

I believe the logic is that this is a week’s worth of meals (lunch/dinner).

Huel uses a 2kcal daily AFAIK, which means that’s five meals per day, a 7 box would only cover 1/5th of DV, or ~40% less than a single meal using the standard three meal “breakfast/lunch/dinner”.

In order for it to conform with a weeks worth of one-meals per box, each box would need to be increased in volume to 670 calories (rounded up from 666.666).

It currently only covers 1 meal in a 5 meal day plan.

@Hope_Huel

@WRBarker

The “Learn more” button has no reason for existing when everything it does is already done on the product page (minus the actually representative picture).

I disagree. In addition to the representative picture, there’s a description of the flavour profile and allergens that is not on the Hot & Savory page itself. For the Mac & Cheeze, this is: “an indulgent, creamy pasta with a subtle smoky cheese flavor and a hint of garlic. Not: contains wheat.”

See below answer, the answer is cumulative to this.

@Hope_Huel

@WRBarker

Can you name another business that when you click on an item in the web store, it doesn’t actually go anywhere, and only changes some flavor text on the upper-right portion of the page?

Yes, clicking on an item and getting more details, rather than going to another page, is quite common practice. Overnight Oats, for one. This is the sort of thing we’d like to set up eventually, where a person can build their own custom box.

I think your misunderstanding.

Your H&S page already has flavor specific pages you access by the industry standard of clicking on the flavor, this is how Overnight Oats works, one click, one description.

I don’t know if your actually aware or not but your website has two different places to get product information.

One, which is incorrect (due to lacking the entirety of your product specific information), is by clicking the product itself (which is how Overnight Oats works they just use what’s called a popout for it).

Two is by clicking the less logically related “Learn more” button independently of the product, which is where you have the rest of the information.

In no situation should these both exist, either there should be no product page by clicking the specific product, or the “Learn more” button shouldn’t exist. One or the other.

You’ve got basically a dozen “splash pages” for no reason, just so the “Learn more” button has a reason to exist at all and there is an excuse to put the marketing carousel on every single page which is ridiculously over-aggressive marketing that makes me think they are some inexperienced college grad with no real world experience.

I bet I can even predict his “reason” for doing it… because “what if people link directly to the product page? How will we instantly sell them on how our product is different?” to answer that question, marketing infographics go below the product specific information always, not inline. If someone wants to know, past looking at the product page for product specific information, they will scroll down.

Overnight Oats solves this problem by putting all of the product information in the callout box when you click on it, so that they have one source of individual product specific information. Which is the right way to do it.

I hope that helps point out the problem, up to you guys if you take the advise or not, but at this point I am deep enough into this that normally I have other businesses pay me for consultation fees.

Good luck though.

This configuration would allow you to completely remove the “Learn more” button, without loosing ANY information and would be more intuitive for customers.

[Hope_Huel]

@WRBarker

That still doesn’t explain why you combine rice w/ pasta, as they don’t share themes either, on top of not sharing texture as rice is fundamentally different from pasta (of which noodles are a sub-type of pasta).

I understand. Granted, we could group the products in all sorts of ways, but this is just how we’ve chosen to do it for now, with our legacy products in one variety box and our new product (Noodles) in another. A fully customizable box should make this easier for everyone.

@WRBarker

Huel uses a 2kcal daily AFAIK, which means that’s five meals per day, a 7 box would only cover 1/5th of DV, or ~40% less than a single meal using the standard three meal “breakfast/lunch/dinner”

It seems like you’re assuming people have 3 meals a day of equal size/nutritional value and no snacks, but that’s rarely how it works out in practice, and we don’t encourage people to have Huel for every meal. People also have varying calorie needs (1600-2400+) and Huel is high in protein and fiber, which can make it more filling than a meal with similar calories. Additionally, the Daily Value for most nutrients is not exactly 1/5th. A Meal Pack will put you at 44% DV for protein and 67% for Vitamin D, for example. The nutrient values can vary based on the nutrients people are more/less likely to get from the rest of their diet. 400 calories is just the portion size that made the most sense for the largest number of people, even if we assume they’re having 3 meals, and one-a-day is a typical cadence.

@WRBarker

In no situation should these both exist, either there should be no product page by clicking the specific product, or the “Learn more” button shouldn’t exist. One or the other.

I see. I understand that it’s weird that there are two buttons that give you more information about the same flavor. I’ve passed that along.

Thank you for your insights! Appreciate you taking the time.